Sunday, August 6, 2017 @ 11:37PM
Dr. Marvin,
Just corrected some of the typos, but we wrote this one letter at a time on our kindle – last part coming home. We were ok – talked to Austin last five minutes before getting home. He wanted us to know whether we went to Green bay or not, that he’d like to come out again Labor Day weekend. We gave him a hug goodbye and we told him that we had a very nice weekend and thanked him for giving us some time on the way home. We also talked to his other grandma for a few nice minutes.
Everyone was more tired and Austin and Rich calmed talking to each other. We felt hurt, angry, cut-out and invisible. We haven’t talked to Rich yet … We didn’t talk to him in the car … just said pizza was ok when he said he didn’t want to cook. I nodded about going into the bedroom, and we rubbed him, but then he put us to bed, he held us hugged for a little bit first, and he went to the bathroom for a while. We didn’t stay in bed. We got up to go to the computer to figure out what had happened. We haven’t been able to talk to him yet. No words are coming out … this used to be called Lissa time.
Earlier
I want to cry … give up. We have a problem with dissociation. I also talked out a long discussion on our Kindle then just lost it. Going to try it again. Shorter. Must do with rich Austin and us. Dynamics. I gave up trying to be in the relationship for the ride home. Discussing angry because rich blocked us or with loud sound … radio classics. This should have been noted by him as feeling life threatening. For us. Went through long hard process of getting our softer music to work with earphones and Kindle where we are at now. Finally, could pull back, withdrawal. Now, we are very hurt. They are privately talking politics … it’s safe between them. Rich is at his element.
He tried earlier to tell me what to do in directing me – conversation, then he pushed … He wanted to tell me how to grandparent. We rebelled. We had let him talk about his grandchildren – just listened and asked questions, but refused rich when he wanted to control mine. He wanted to say something about needing to control the direction of their minds. We were saying, no you must let them be open-minded.
We had upset Austin by us telling rich how to drive … just reminded him not to miss a turn … We made a mistake, but had just been checking in as second driver. Austin was critical of me. Defended rich. We apologized and said I must be a back-seat driver. But then ten minutes later rich made a driving mistake, and we corrected him again, and he didn’t listen. So, we went the wrong way. We went south on the expressway instead of north. He corrected, then we said yay backseat drivers won one in a little voice. It was mean and then we stopped nobody said anything, but soon rich turned on abusive sound so he wouldn’t have to mentally listen to us, and again we dissociated – disengaged.
He went on to lecture Austin but in a nice way. Austin asks a lot of questions. We hid behind kindle and music. Periodically, we check in to see if they are still talking politics. it was ok … Austin just checking out new opinions. Austin is now talking and rich with less steam should listen more. We’re still hiding resolute but not going to come out.
Pre-lunch before we started driving, had got overwhelming … Austin was playing the games at Dave and Busters. Rich going close minded and in control and us trying to stay open-minded rich had tried to say we should stick close to Austin during games but we told him way too loud in game center. But, Austin could do games on his own we were in the next room. He was good with that and we were giving him time on his own to be independent. He had $25 worth of chips. He was ok.
Rich was fighting against us all morning started by telling us what we should do in room but, we’d put everything in suitcases already, except dog dishes and our shoes, and put bags in living room by door. … We were already ready and had a separate tv … think rich needed his separate time but sometimes, doesn’t want us not to need him, and be happily independent. He likes to be bossy. *sigh*
We just tried to interrupt. We did excuse us and asked if anyone wanted a drink (cooler behind me). Austin said yes and rich did no. Then Austin said we were going to stop at a gas station in a few moments. I said fine. And then asked can I have a five. Rich said not for candy. I repeated and asked for a five (Rich knew we were going to buy candy). Austin said something and we massaged his shoulders for a second, and said you are very protective of Rich.
He said frustrated if we were going to get in an accident and die – if I asked for rich’s wallet (in his pocket). I said equally as strong, but positive no I don’t want to get in an accident and die. Then I said but I will want a five. Then we said earphones! And, we went back to listening to music and writing. They were taking but now aren’t talking. I kept our sense of humor but didn’t like being controlled by Austin and Rich … Like the two oversaw me or that I could be disrespected. Like now there could be TWO of them telling me what to do?
We were trying to gain ground, but lost. but at this point I don’t want to lose Austin’s total respect, I don’t want to talk either. If they don’t want to be nice. I will take my marbles and go elsewhere. I can keep myself to be busy for a long time. I don’t like men against women or parents against child (with us sometimes being more the child, although we try hard to stay adult). Austin is learning from Rich how to treat his Grandma as a Multiple. Better think of this after gas station.
It seems like this experience of the afternoon with Rich and Austin has us fighting with the basic feelings of our constant life and death struggle, but we should ask ourselves we should realize, that we’ve been dissociating with the withdrawal. It now seems like if neither want to relate to me, I might as well not be here. Why would anyone be being ignored? Please let me be giving the appearance of just sitting back here patiently listening and reading. This is going to need be communicated with Dr. Marvin. Don’t want the time down with rich. I wonder if Austin looks toward Rich for Thom’s missing male training, along with Mike. He’s missing his two Grandfathers too. Maybe Mike has a Dad?
We were kind enough at the gas station. Both offered to pay for me but we have too much pride to accept their money. Or for them to think, I can’t take care of myself. I did pull away from rich. He knows I’m mad but hopefully he won’t get into anything over next 1 1/2 hours while Austin is in the car. I don’t want Austin’s space disturbed.
I think for Austin I present as too much emotions and dialog? Just don’t know. He knows his own system needs equilibrium … that’s the most important part is that we protect his space. I don’t want to let him know that the mental thing was hurtful. He is learning between manners – caring for others – and taking care of his needs first. I want him to feel in control of his choices. I want him to know that I can answer anything for him, or will tell him I don’t know, but I’m here … but, I won’t seek out “just” attention with anybody here either.
I suppose each of them asking separately to help pay when we were in or toward the gas station – without the other knowing that the other had asked to help me pay for something – well, we wanted out of that emotional sinkhole. We let them both out. We told them we appreciated the offer, but no thank you. Think how could we avoid problems next time. Probably we’ll take our own money out for pocket change, so we’re not depended. The money issue was unfortunately rude with Austin learning from Rich – both questioning me on what I would spend money on, rather than I could spend money on anything I wanted within reason … like just five dollars.
Wow. I just asked Austin for a napkin from the glove compartment. I had to blow my nose. I had to interrupt him from talking to rich. Then he said wait. Did you take your medicine? And I said yes. Then I thought and asked, did that come from him, or rich? He said from him, he had heard rich ask before. I said great and I thanked him for being concerned. But we were frustrated.
That’s not something I wanted him learning that the Stepford wives had to be medicated by males. I told him honestly, I’d taken our medicine ten minutes earlier. I wanted him to learn his hunch was accurate – intuitive, but I’d taken care of myself. We allowed him to be gentlemanly instead of controlling. We are not sure of riches motives. We think his purity not there, and it is more him not wanting to deal with me being emotional, where Austin I believe was more like trying to help. He was trying to read me. It was embarrassing. I do see him picking up cues.
Now want to keep my earphones on, so I didn’t interrupt rich and Austin’s conversation, and because we’re tired. This is beneficial … I hope the conversation is positive male to male instead of them trying to cut us out. I’m going to trust that for now. I wish I were more missed, it’s been a long time since talking, but that is just us feeling I wish we were missed, but know we’re not. At this point, I don’t trust our thinking and we don’t know when we turned the two of them off. think I could appreciate that I’m around a lot and that they need special time too and that they get things from each other. What do they get from me?
Maybe this is part of questioning yourself and again sense of worth. I could be thinking that both know I need some alone time and that they need time too, and maybe drop it there. I just interjected and told Austin he should call his mother to let her know he would be in about an hour so she could plan. He said that he’d told his grandmother he would be going to his grandmothers for an hour. I said fine, he should contact her then. He said ok but didn’t appear to do much directly. I don’t know if he was quick our if he figures his earlier conversation was accurate enough to her with an estimated 5PM arrival time. At least he wasn’t sarcastic of this advice. Ahh he seems to be doing that now – texting someone. I did say after he finished eating that he never must ask permission to call his mother or grandmother.
I should make goals with both Rich and Austin. We’re about to cross into an hour left of our trip. I’d like to have some reflective time …more like letting him know I enjoyed his trip with both Rich and us, and that we probably both had different kinds of highlights and that this was due to Austin being good company. Reframing, right? I know writing and soft music is good for us. We should also thank him for him giving us time on our own driving home. And that we’d needed time to relax and write.
But even with the bumps, we enjoyed the whole experience. That might be enough for him. He might have something to say or questions about the trip. Hmm maybe he gives his mother small breaks too. His mother has more needs with two grandchildren. He also must know that I’m secure enough to let him have quiet time with rich who is a good grandfather personality.
We need to create an executable cue for him, so that he can politely “beg-off” from me and then talk to only Rich. Like him saying, “I wouldn’t mind talking to Rich if you are ready for some private time.” I really don’t want to brush him off, but I don’t know what parts of our relationship he values. He probably doesn’t like competitiveness between Rich and us. Probably doesn’t like to feel pressure between us. Who does. He’s perceptive. I think I want him to ask for my attention, I don’t want to guess all the time. I don’t want to be needy with him, while letting him still know, we’re here to take care of things, including him and Rich. Just motherly. Just want him to respect me, and I should know that he values me differently than Rich. I also want him to respect us as a couple.
I don’t want him to feel that Rich when tired, sometimes acts 50’s and may look down on me, especially as a woman. At least, at this moment, it is what it seems. Is this what we’re showing Austin? Rich? That we need to be “taken care of – without our opinion?” We battling wanting to connect issues. We don’t want them to see us this confused. We want to stay hidden … they are only allowing for what? Not invited to their conversation. I feel blocked.
Dr. Marvin,
These are just dynamic – communications problems … the three of us learning to be together under a little more stress, right? The last five to six minutes went well. Surprisingly, Austin brought up and seemed very eager to do something Labor Day weekend, even if we couldn’t go to Green Bay. I felt happy thinking, we didn’t turn him off, completely. He just needed an experience we couldn’t give him – But, Rich could at that moment. Right? We can talk about it on Tuesday. Thank you.
4 pages (2465 words)
